Reminder: #OhmHour Occurrences and Notifications

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Comments

  • WaterGuyWaterGuy Member, Moderator Posts: 414

    @John K, while I think you do have a point, I suspect the reality of the situation is a bit less sweeping than what you portrayed. There will always be folks like @UkiwiS (and myself, if I'm honest) who will try to maximize their earnings when presented with a system that lends itself to some strategic thinking. However, I'd question your statement that "if the program didn't exist, we'd have never had many of these imbalances in the first place." Only a few percent of people in San Diego drive electric vehicles, and I suspect that their impact on the aggregated savings OhmConnect can offer to the utilities is very small compared to the savings offered by people shutting off their AC during OhmHours. (I haven't yet heard of any widespread AC use designed to game the system). If the EV folks were capable of creating grid imbalances worthy of OhmHours, then we'd have more OhmHours in the middle of the night when most EV owners charge their vehicles. The peak demand issue obviously existed long before OhmConnect created incentives to address it. I think one solution would be for the utilities to continue increasing the cost of power during peak demand times for high-energy users, until the stick is bigger than the carrot.

    On a more personal note, I'd hate to throw @UkiwiS under the bus or paint him as somehow unethical or anti-environment for engaging in the incentives. In addition to being very helpful and active on the forum and getting people excited because of his remarkable earnings, he has solar panels and generates much of his own energy. If you want to get technical about it, he actually helps balance the grid during the afternoon when energy usage is greatest around the city.

  • BayMavsBayMavs Member Posts: 17

    @UkiwiS said:

    @BayMavs said:
    @water> @WaterGuy said:

    @BayMavs, @UkiwiS (and some other savvy users) charge their electric vehicles during the hours when they normally receive OhmHours. By shifting the energy use they'd incur anyway to those time slots, they can boost their forecasts. I'd bet his forecast for a morning OhmHour would be much smaller.

    So I understand correctly, are you saying that some users will use more energy during the OhmHours so that they receive higher forecasts next time. If Yes, then what happens to the Streak ?

    Yes, this is exactly what I do but I think you're a little confused. The forecast is based on the previous days usage at that timeslot. 10 days for a weekday or 4 for a weekend. We're not using more during an OhmHour, we're alway using less. Streak Bonus is retained. I know that 33% of my OhmHours are 7-8 and another 33% are 8-9. I'm only "available" for those after 6pm and I "work" my forecast during those times/days when there is no #OhmHour. Technically it costs me more to charge the car when I do (vs after midnight) but it inflates the forecast significantly. Now, when there is an #OhmHour I turn everything off, including the car...forecast is high so easy to beat it and retain bonus.

    For example, yesterday's OhmHour Sunday 7-8pm. I saved 5.501 kWh (not scored yet) and on platinum with 160% bonus it should be about $55 by my estimates.

    Thanks for explaining. You doing great. I'm at 160% bonus and platinum. One more question, Is the bonus capped at 2000 points or it goes beyond that. If the bonus is capped at 2000 then how is it coming to $55 in savings

  • WaterGuyWaterGuy Member, Moderator Posts: 414

    @BayMavs, I think OhmConnect has a feature that limits the automatic payout to 2000 points, so that if there's a bug they won't accidentally give away too much money. However, @snetphilie and @UkiwiS have reported that you can get the full amount by contacting OC support and requesting it.

  • The Bitz BoysThe Bitz Boys Union CityModerator Posts: 1,017

    In my opinion, I think that once it's been verified that any earnings that exceed 2,000 points are legitimately earned and are not the result of any metering or data issues, users should automatically get the rest of their earnings rather than have to contact OC support to request it. Hopefully, they can automate that process in the near future.

  • WaterGuyWaterGuy Member, Moderator Posts: 414

    @That Son Of A Bitz, I agree. It'd be nice if the algorithm could simply check whether a) the user's average earnings are over 2000 points and b) whether they purchased a Baseline Boost card, and, if either of those are true, assume that any calculated point totals over 2000 are valid.

  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoMember, Moderator Posts: 1,625
    edited June 2017

    @WaterGuy said:
    @BayMavs, I think OhmConnect has a feature that limits the automatic payout to 2000 points, so that if there's a bug they won't accidentally give away too much money. However, @snetphilie and @UkiwiS have reported that you can get the full amount by contacting OC support and requesting it.

    This is correct. It's more of a "limit" than a "cap" and it's a manual process to get the extra. I believe the limit is increasing to 4000 points and may have been increased already as some of my recent #OhmHours were recalculated and already > 2000.

    I expect last night's event to post tonight so we'll see if it's "limited" to 4000.

  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoMember, Moderator Posts: 1,625

    @WaterGuy said:
    @John K, while I think you do have a point, I suspect the reality of the situation is a bit less sweeping than what you portrayed. There will always be folks like @UkiwiS (and myself, if I'm honest) who will try to maximize their earnings when presented with a system that lends itself to some strategic thinking. However, I'd question your statement that "if the program didn't exist, we'd have never had many of these imbalances in the first place." Only a few percent of people in San Diego drive electric vehicles, and I suspect that their impact on the aggregated savings OhmConnect can offer to the utilities is very small compared to the savings offered by people shutting off their AC during OhmHours. (I haven't yet heard of any widespread AC use designed to game the system.) If the EV folks were capable of creating grid imbalances worthy of OhmHours, then we'd have more OhmHours in the middle of the night when most EV owners charge their vehicles. The peak demand issue obviously existed long before OhmConnect created incentives to address it. I think the real solution would be for the utilities to continue increasing the cost of power during peak demand times for high-energy users, and do so until the stick is bigger than the carrot for folks participating in the OhmHours.

    On a more personal note, it doesn't really seem fair to throw @UkiwiS under the bus or paint him as somehow unethical or anti-environment for the way he engages with the incentives. In addition to being very helpful and active on the forum and getting people excited because of his remarkable earnings, he has solar panels and generates much of his own energy. If you want to get technical about it, he actually helps balance the grid during the afternoon when energy usage is greatest in our city, and it's quite likely his positive contributions outweigh his increased evening use.

    @WaterGuy. @John K
    I considered keeping quiet and flying under the radar but in the end I thought it's better to share what I do with others. I have also questioned OC about the sustainability of the program but received no answer and have received nothing but encouragement from them. By all appearances they are paying me a lot but it's not a one way street, I'm also giving them a lot in savings that they can rely on.

  • John KJohn K Lake Forest - Hikers and Bikers TeamMember Posts: 585

    @WaterGuy said:
    @John K, while I think you do have a point, I suspect the reality of the situation is a bit less sweeping than what you portrayed. There will always be folks like @UkiwiS (and myself, if I'm honest) who will try to maximize their earnings when presented with a system that lends itself to some strategic thinking. However, I'd question your statement that "if the program didn't exist, we'd have never had many of these imbalances in the first place." Only a few percent of people in San Diego drive electric vehicles, and I suspect that their impact on the aggregated savings OhmConnect can offer to the utilities is very small compared to the savings offered by people shutting off their AC during OhmHours. (I haven't yet heard of any widespread AC use designed to game the system.) If the EV folks were capable of creating grid imbalances worthy of OhmHours, then we'd have more OhmHours in the middle of the night when most EV owners charge their vehicles. The peak demand issue obviously existed long before OhmConnect created incentives to address it. I think the real solution would be for the utilities to continue increasing the cost of power during peak demand times for high-energy users, and do so until the stick is bigger than the carrot for folks participating in the OhmHours.

    On a more personal note, it doesn't really seem fair to throw @UkiwiS under the bus or paint him as somehow unethical or anti-environment for the way he engages with the incentives. In addition to being very helpful and active on the forum and getting people excited because of his remarkable earnings, he has solar panels and generates much of his own energy. If you want to get technical about it, he actually helps balance the grid during the afternoon when energy usage is greatest in our city, and it's quite likely his positive contributions outweigh his increased evening use.

    @WaterGuy, while I admire your defense of @UkiwiS's tactics, I'm confident that if you re-read my post, you'll see I was not throwing anybody under any bus, except maybe 1.) the utilities for not incentivizing people to shift their usage to current off-peak hours without simultaneously punishing them for any portion they can't shift, and 2.) CAISO (and thus the facepalm reference) for being late to understand what the current plan encourages. In fact, For heaven's sake don't suggest raising the price during current peak usage . . . the right answer is to ****REDUCE the price during off-peak hours. I agree that anybody not using the plan as it is presented, isn't thinking very straight. I do question the wisdom of so many public posts suggesting doing loads of wash, charging cars, and cooking at what has become the new high-usage time of early evening; see the recent change and creation of CA's Duck Curve:

    As for us EV charging folks, if you don't think a few percent of the population shifting 3.3-10+ kW of usage to each of the peak hours makes little difference, I think you are mistaken. But, as you point out, that is the way they have set the system up.

  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoMember, Moderator Posts: 1,625
    edited June 2017

    @UkiwiS said:

    @WaterGuy said:
    @BayMavs, I think OhmConnect has a feature that limits the automatic payout to 2000 points, so that if there's a bug they won't accidentally give away too much money. However, @snetphilie and @UkiwiS have reported that you can get the full amount by contacting OC support and requesting it.

    This is correct. It's more of a "limit" than a "cap" and it's a manual process to get the extra. I believe the limit is increasing to 4000 points and may have been increased already as some of my recent #OhmHours were recalculated and already > 2000.

    I expect last night's event to post tonight so we'll see if it's "limited" to 4000.

    The "limit" remains at 2000.

  • WaterGuyWaterGuy Member, Moderator Posts: 414
    edited June 2017

    @UkiwiS, how do you contact support when you hit the limit and want to ask for a manual adjustment to your points? Do you email them directly? I ask because I've seen several users comment that the Contact Us Here button doesn't seem to be working correctly.

  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoMember, Moderator Posts: 1,625
    edited June 2017

    @WaterGuy said:
    @UkiwiS, how do you contact support when you hit the limit and want to ask for a manual adjustment to your points? Do you email them directly? I ask because I've seen several users comment that the Contact Us Here button doesn't seem to be working correctly.

    I used to use the chat feature but now email them directly. It is typically @Matt D and @curtistongue that respond and credit my account so I'll let them chime in just in case there is a preferred way they want people to get in touch.

  • snetphiliesnetphilie ConcordMember, Moderator Posts: 139

    Two observations:

    1 - I got 2949 points automatically awarded for Sunday's OhmHour so the limit has either been raised for everyone or can be raised for individuals.

    2 - Only 4 of my 10 smart devices responded during Sunday's OhmHour, and all devices are responding to on/off commands from the connect page so I'm guessing they had issues with those as well.

  • sciencegirlsciencegirl Member Posts: 2

    Seriously? I went over 0.002 kWh over and lost points??? I was forecast to be at 0.278 and hit 0.28 and lost points. This program is ridiculous.

  • SkippydogSkippydog Irvine, CAMember Posts: 4
    edited June 2017

    This is odd! I went over on my last ohm hour. The only way that would be possible is if ohmconnect didn't dispatch the shutdown command to all my smart plugs and thermostat! Did anyone else have this issue on the last one? I had 35 reductions in a row before this!

  • WaterGuyWaterGuy Member, Moderator Posts: 414

    @sciencegirl said:
    Seriously? I went over 0.002 kWh over and lost points??? I was forecast to be at 0.278 and hit 0.28 and lost points. This program is ridiculous.

    @sciencegirl, why is that ridiculous? I think the rules of the program are pretty clear. If you had just barely gotten under your forecast, you likely wouldn't be upset by the difference of 0.002 kWh. OhmConnect makes money based on how much you reduce your energy, so they're not going to reward you if you use more than normal, regardless of how close it was.

  • WaterGuyWaterGuy Member, Moderator Posts: 414

    @Skippydog said:
    This is odd! I went over on my last ohm hour. The only way that would be possible is if ohmconnect didn't dispatch the shutdown command to all my smart plugs and thermostat! Did anyone else have this issue on the last one? I had 35 reductions in a row before this!

    Others have posted about this recently, too, and it does seem to be a problem. If you do a search, you'll find threads like this one:

    https://forum.ohmconnect.com/discussion/935/smart-devices-didnt-switch-off-june-18-7-8-pm-ohmhour

    I'd recommend checking for a thread relevant to your question before posting--I think it's helpful to keep like posts in the same place so the moderators and admin can see which issues are affecting lots of people, and so you can find posted answers more easily.

  • clekoehrclekoehr Member Posts: 2
    I get every ohm hour EXACTLY ten minutes before it begins. I have never gotten more notice than that. I think it's ridiculous and I'm probably going to have to just stop participating altogether. Very disappointing but I can't constantly be checking my phone at 10 till to see if I should frantically run around the house turning things off, or worse am not home and can't participate because of zero planning.

    Perhaps a longer time limit on opting out when there's short notice? I often am doing something - cooking, showering, playing with my kids and can miss the entire window would have to opt out. Very disheartening.
  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoMember, Moderator Posts: 1,625

    @[email protected].com said:
    I get every ohm hour EXACTLY ten minutes before it begins. I have never gotten more notice than that. I think it's ridiculous and I'm probably going to have to just stop participating altogether. Very disappointing but I can't constantly be checking my phone at 10 till to see if I should frantically run around the house turning things off, or worse am not home and can't participate because of zero planning.

    Perhaps a longer time limit on opting out when there's short notice? I often am doing something - cooking, showering, playing with my kids and can miss the entire window would have to opt out. Very disheartening.

    You should look at getting the devices that can automatically turn off things to save energy, such as smart thermostats and TPLink devices. With these you will be saving automatically during an OhmHour and you won't need to pay such close attention.

    Cooking is more complicated, but if you always cook at a certain time...say 5-6:30pm...you can change your settings to exclude this time-slot. You won't be notified, you won't participate and you won't lose your status level or streak bonus.

  • clekoehrclekoehr Member Posts: 2

    Yeah that's great and we're considering adding that, but it's a little silly that I can't participate unless I have those things. I guess I just find it hard to believe that my block hasn't gotten advance notice even once this entire year, when my neighbors don't seem to have this problem.

    @UkiwiS said:

    @[email protected].com said:
    I get every ohm hour EXACTLY ten minutes before it begins. I have never gotten more notice than that. I think it's ridiculous and I'm probably going to have to just stop participating altogether. Very disappointing but I can't constantly be checking my phone at 10 till to see if I should frantically run around the house turning things off, or worse am not home and can't participate because of zero planning.

    Perhaps a longer time limit on opting out when there's short notice? I often am doing something - cooking, showering, playing with my kids and can miss the entire window would have to opt out. Very disheartening.

    You should look at getting the devices that can automatically turn off things to save energy, such as smart thermostats and TPLink devices. With these you will be saving automatically during an OhmHour and you won't need to pay such close attention.

    Cooking is more complicated, but if you always cook at a certain time...say 5-6:30pm...you can change your settings to exclude this time-slot. You won't be notified, you won't participate and you won't lose your status level or streak bonus.

  • WaterGuyWaterGuy Member, Moderator Posts: 414

    @[email protected], that may be something to take up with your utility, as the timing issue is almost certainly on their end. OhmConnect wants as many people to participate as possible and for them to reduce as much as possible, so there's no incentive for them to sit on a warning and catch folks by surprise.

    By the way, it's possible you get paid more per kWh than other folks who predominately get notifications the day before. There are a few different sources of OhmHours, and the ones you're receiving in your neighborhood may be based predominately on real-time pricing. It'd be interesting to compare the points/kWh with some of the folks who live near you and get more advance notice.

  • BayMavsBayMavs Member Posts: 17

    @BayMavs said:

    @UkiwiS said:

    @BayMavs said:
    @water> @WaterGuy said:

    @BayMavs, @UkiwiS (and some other savvy users) charge their electric vehicles during the hours when they normally receive OhmHours. By shifting the energy use they'd incur anyway to those time slots, they can boost their forecasts. I'd bet his forecast for a morning OhmHour would be much smaller.

    So I understand correctly, are you saying that some users will use more energy during the OhmHours so that they receive higher forecasts next time. If Yes, then what happens to the Streak ?

    Yes, this is exactly what I do but I think you're a little confused. The forecast is based on the previous days usage at that timeslot. 10 days for a weekday or 4 for a weekend. We're not using more during an OhmHour, we're alway using less. Streak Bonus is retained. I know that 33% of my OhmHours are 7-8 and another 33% are 8-9. I'm only "available" for those after 6pm and I "work" my forecast during those times/days when there is no #OhmHour. Technically it costs me more to charge the car when I do (vs after midnight) but it inflates the forecast significantly. Now, when there is an #OhmHour I turn everything off, including the car...forecast is high so easy to beat it and retain bonus.

    For example, yesterday's OhmHour Sunday 7-8pm. I saved 5.501 kWh (not scored yet) and on platinum with 160% bonus it should be about $55 by my estimates.

    Thanks for explaining. You doing great. I'm at 160% bonus and platinum. One more question, Is the bonus capped at 2000 points or it goes beyond that. If the bonus is capped at 2000 then how is it coming to $55 in savings

    @UkiwiS One more clarification: Take this example: If let's say my next Ohm hour is on Friday 7/7 (weekday) 8-9 PM.

    Are you referring that my forecast for 7/7 will be based on my consumption between 8-9PM on previous 10 weekdays (which will be 7/6,7/5,7/4,7/3,6/30, 6/29,6/28,6/27,6/26,6/23) ?
    OR
    My forecast will be based on my consumption between 8-9 PM on previous 10 fridays?

  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoMember, Moderator Posts: 1,625

    @UkiwiS One more clarification: Take this example: If let's say my next Ohm hour is on Friday 7/7 (weekday) 8-9 PM.

    Are you referring that my forecast for 7/7 will be based on my consumption between 8-9PM on previous 10 weekdays (which will be 7/6,7/5,7/4,7/3,6/30, 6/29,6/28,6/27,6/26,6/23) ?

    Yes...this. But any previous days on which there were #OhmHours are excluded from the calcs so you need to include prior days. Also, note that 7/4 is treated as a weekend day.

  • SaveTheWorldSaveTheWorld Member, Moderator Posts: 39
    edited July 2017

    @UkiwiS said:

    @UkiwiS One more clarification: Take this example: If let's say my next Ohm hour is on Friday 7/7 (weekday) 8-9 PM.

    Are you referring that my forecast for 7/7 will be based on my consumption between 8-9PM on previous 10 weekdays (which will be 7/6,7/5,7/4,7/3,6/30, 6/29,6/28,6/27,6/26,6/23) ?

    Yes...this. But any previous days on which there were #OhmHours are excluded from the calcs so you need to include prior days. Also, note that 7/4 is treated as a weekend day.

    Also I had noticed that mostly we get the notification about ohm hour with the forecast a day before the event. So the previous day is not considered in the calculation for the average. For example if ohmhour is on 7/7 then we receive the notification on 7/6. So the target will be based on the average of 10 days before 7/6 and not including 7/6.

    @UkiwiS Correct me if I am wrong.

  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoMember, Moderator Posts: 1,625
    @SaveTheWorld That's correct. My experience with SDG&E is that the data is available around Noon for the previous day. If you can be bothered you can figure it out yourself but it gets pretty complicated and time consuming when days need to be excluded. I've not seen any errors on the part of OC for a few months.
  • Crystal JonesCrystal Jones Member Posts: 1
    > @Nancy Zamorano said:
    > I have had multiple ones that I received NO notification of at all by any method. I only knew there was one when I heard the refrigerator ice maker click back on after my connected devices turned everything back on.

    Yesterday I was out of the house shopping and returned to my house over 80 degrees. I checked my emails/texts and had no indicator of an OHM hour so I turned the AC on. I logged into OHM app and found that I was in an OHM hour with NO notice at all. Luckily it was only 10 minutes in and I could turn everything off - but the app didn't even turn off my smart plugs only the AC unit. I am not sure if I was supposed to be on OHM or not - and am going to be soo upset if I lose points or my streak!
  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoMember, Moderator Posts: 1,625
    edited July 2017

    @Crystal Jones
    Send an email in to [email protected] so they can look into it and troubleshoot if necessary.

  • Anthony RosasAnthony Rosas Member Posts: 1
    Please create a setting to auto-opt out if notification is "Less than X minutes from OH" I'd like to help save the grid from over utilization, but logistically speaking, this creates havoc instead of smart energy-saving. Even with smart plugs in a small apartment I accidentally turned on the AC because I saw the alert and had to do a double take that it was actually happening this very minute.
  • Philip ChildsPhilip Childs Member Posts: 28
    I received today OhmHour 12 minutes before it started. This is the first time I haven't had days notice.
  • The Bitz BoysThe Bitz Boys Union CityModerator Posts: 1,017
    This is normal. OC sends alerts when they get alerted and in this case, the electric grid operator notified them last minute as well. If only they could predict the future...

    From experience, I would say that OH's without a day's notice, only happens 5-10% of the time in my area. But because the demand for electricity and its price differs based on where you live, you could get these short notice OhmHours more or less often.
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