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Would you try harder to save if there were new Status incentives?

No Pain No GainNo Pain No Gain 93035Posts: 404Member
edited March 2018 in General Discussion

Would you put more effort into your OhmHours if there were more incentives?

There are a lot of Platinum users now, many of whom find 40% an easy goal.

Maybe add gemstones for higher status? Example:

Emerald - 60% savings - 100 tokens/OH.
Ruby - 70%, 150 tokens/OH
Sapphire - 80%, 200 tokens/OH

For me, this would add to the OhmConnect experience, which I participate in like a game, trying to beat my own "scores", but you don't have to be a nerd to appreciate some extra tokens. :smiley:

Just a suggestion, but I think it would look great on the dashboard.

Best Answer

Answers

  • Morris familyMorris family Posts: 6Member
    I think it's a great idea. I especially like the idea of added incentives for those with higher percentages. I'm at an 89% savings, and had been at 94% for several months.
  • CraigWCraigW Posts: 45Member

    I think it is a creative and good idea. I would like something that earns move tokens. I would however be cautious of loading the system even more towards high usage users with EVs, even though that benefits me. It's supply and demand and the system is tilted pretty heavily towards users with a easily shifted heavy load.

  • No Pain No GainNo Pain No Gain 93035Posts: 404Member

    @CraigW Maybe because my forecasts are low, I don't understand about "loading the system even more towards high usage users with EVs".
    What I was suggesting is some sort of incentive to get people to save more each OhmHour. For me to stay in the 80% range, I have to work at it, not just turn the lights and fridge off during an OhmHour. My reward for that would be the extra tokens for that percentage range. The EV users would have no effect on my percentage. OhmConnect would benefit from members consistently saving more.

    Are you saying there would be a down side if more people were saving more energy during an OhmHour?

  • cwiedcwied San MateoPosts: 131Member

    The high usage users with EVs have a much easier time reaching higher reduction percentages than those with low usage. That means that any new statuses/bonuses would tend to reward them more than the lower usage individuals. Adding new statuses would tend to mean that a bigger slice of the pie goes to the high usage folks.

  • No Pain No GainNo Pain No Gain 93035Posts: 404Member

    @cwohmcon I understand what you're saying - that users who have EVs get higher percentages saved, but that wouldn't affect my savings or my potential reward. In fact, I wouldn't even know how many users were getting any of those rewards. But you and @CraigW think this would be an unfair incentive?

    The original question I asked, though: Would you put more effort into your OhmHours if there were more incentives?

    I suppose EV users wouldn't have to put much effort to get the extra tokens. But there are users who have low forecasts like me, who might do a little more during an OhmHour to get some extra tokens. I'd like to be able to afford a Baseline Boost every 8 months instead of once a year. :smile: I suppose if the EV users are able to buy them too often, the price will go up again. Hmmm.... Maybe EV users should be left out of this one. I see your point now.

  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoPosts: 1,595Member, Moderator

    @No Pain No Gain FYI, the card doesn't "boost" your forecast by 5 kWh, it simply sets it to 5 kWh.

    If you are an EV user and you have a forecast of let's say 7 kWh, would you buy a baseline boost?

  • No Pain No GainNo Pain No Gain 93035Posts: 404Member

    @UkiwiS No, I wouldn't buy a Baseline Boost if my forecast is 7 kWh. I was just thinking out loud trying to figure out why someone would think giving some extra tokens for maintaining a high savings percentage would unfairly benefit EV users and somehow cheat the non-EV users out of their share of the pie. Since I don't see what EV users have for a baseline, I suppose that would look like a very stupid comment for me to make. Now I know and won't use that for an example again. :smile:

  • No Pain No GainNo Pain No Gain 93035Posts: 404Member
    edited March 2018

    @cwohmcon Thank you for patiently explaining the slice of pie thing as it relates to both points and tokens. However, when EV users make more because they have a higher savings percentage, doesn't the amount OC makes go up, too? The way you explained it, my understanding is OC gets a set amount and divides it up accordingly. I don't know how their bidding system works, so if it's a set amount, then what you say is true. I have always thought OC is paid for what we save as a whole, as long as it's above a minimum amount. If it doesn't meet the minimum savings promised, then OC loses money and so do those who didn't beat their forecast, and that keeps it fair for the rest of us.
    Anyway... I'm just looking for more tokens. :smile:

  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoPosts: 1,595Member, Moderator
    edited March 2018
    @No Pain No Gain It's not stupid at all but you probably never thought of it from that perspective. If it truly was a boost it would be worth getting but from where I sit the only card I'd use tokens on is the streak shield and I purchased one last week.

    I was away for 2 weeks and my forecasts got lower and lower as I was using no energy. I splashed out and got the shield for some peace of mind.
  • No Pain No GainNo Pain No Gain 93035Posts: 404Member

    @UkiwiS I already have a Streak Shield, which is why my mind went to the next best card for me. I'm going away for a week and have chosen to keep accepting OhmHours, relying on my smart plugs to keep me under my forecast, but if something goes wrong, I have the Streak Shield and won't be worrying about it while I'm away. Definitely peace of mind.

  • CraigWCraigW Posts: 45Member
    edited March 2018

    @No Pain No Gain I guess the short answer is no. I used to be a low use user before we bought the EV. I posted the same type of questions on the value of participating. I had forecasts of like 0.6 or 0.4 kwh but as a solar user had status requirements of 0.8 kwh reduction (kind of hard doing the OH after dark)

    At a payout of 100 point per kwh before bonuses it's simply not worth it. If I'm trying to protect a long streak maybe, but really, that becomes a bit of a futile effort. Okay, 40 long streak for 200% bonus, plus platinum status. A 0.6kwh forecast and savings of 80% or .48 kwh. The point allocation 48+ 96+48 = 196 points.

    Seriously $1.96. And that's pretty extreme savings on a super long streak at targets that are easy to miss. We're talking unplugging the fridges and not just turning off devices but unplugging all the vampire pulls too. I thought it was a fun game architecture, then I ran into I need to start pulling the plug on my fridge at (0.08kwh) in an attempt to make it. Or turn off everything and go out for dinner, or a bike, oh wait it's dark, a walk, but it's dinner time... The reality is without unplugging all my vampire feeds or baseline feeds like the fridge, i'm quibbling over controllable usage around .2 to .4 kwh. A set LEDs light, an LED TV, my wifi and heat that may cycle once during the hour for about 10 minutes.

    More importantly, from an environmental standpoint, I think we're actually massively counter productive by chasing grid balance this way instead of building an adequate efficient and more friendly production network.

    I've been at it almost a year and I'm still 4000 token away from a streak shied. I get 1 for logging in once a day and I get 20 when I respond to an ohm hour.

  • cwiedcwied San MateoPosts: 131Member

    @No Pain No Gain - you are correct that the pie gets bigger if people save more. However, if you give bigger bonuses by giving the high-use users higher statuses, they will get more than their "fair" share of the additional earnings. Look at it this way: if everybody has the same status level, any incremental earning should just come back to the user earning it. However, if that user has a bonus, the bonus will need to be paid out of the amount awarded to other users, meaning that paradoxically the extra earnings mean everybody else earns less.

    Here's an example. User 1 gets a 100% bonus. User 2 gets no bonuses. If they both gained 1 base point by saving 1 kWh and the pool is $3, User 1 gets $2 and User 2 gets $1. Now, if User 1 saves an additional kWh, the prize pool goes up to $4.50. User 1 has 4 points, User 2 still 1 point. This means User 1 now gets $3.60 and User 2 only gets $.90.

    Caveat: I'm making assumptions about how the awards are calculated based on quotes I've seen in articles about OhmConnect's business model. I don't believe the actual formulas have been made public. I don't think there is a viable business model if it doesn't work this way, though.

    Obviously awarding tokens instead of points would avoid this issue, so I think that's the only way I think adding more statuses would make sense.

  • No Pain No GainNo Pain No Gain 93035Posts: 404Member

    @CraigW You should be getting 20 tokens for opening the OH email and 20 for answering what you're doing. If you post a photo to Instagram during an OH, you get 40 tokens. If you join the Buddy program, you get 100 (if you both have a successful OH). For every post on the Buddy page, you get 5 tokens. I have smart plugs on all the things you unplug, so I get 10 tokens each for 9 of those. Watch for surveys and get 100 tokens for those. You'll get there!

  • No Pain No GainNo Pain No Gain 93035Posts: 404Member

    @cwied I'm going to remove the points off my post. The tokens make more sense. It was just an idea and obviously I have too much time on my hands. lol :D Thanks for that explanation and your thoughts on how it would work.

  • CKWMCKWM Fremont, CAPosts: 235Member

    @No Pain No Gain - This is the first time I'm hearing that a person can earn points for having smart plugs. You saying that you have 9 smart plugs going on at the same time at your house... you're automatically getting 90 tokens because of that?

    You must have discovered one of the methods mentioned in this last bullet point:

    Anybody know of any other non-listed ways to earn tokens?

  • UkiwiSUkiwiS San DiegoPosts: 1,595Member, Moderator

    @CKWM
    You are catching on. There's lots of little things that you can do that will add up, over time. They're like compounding interest. The 3 big things you can do for no cost are.
    1. Get a good buddy (100 tokens per OhmHour)
    2. Post to Instagram (40)
    3. Click the notification link (20)
    4. Tell OC how you are saving (20)

    There's 180 tokens per OhmHour. Have devices turning off is worth another 10 per event but there is a cost for those devices. I recommend you wait till they have a 2 for 1 deal and accumulate over time.

  • No Pain No GainNo Pain No Gain 93035Posts: 404Member

    @CKWM
    Just a clarification - The post to Instagram for 40 tokens must be during the #OhmHour and use the IG icon on the OhmHour notification, otherwise you have to write in and tell OC you posted to Instagram even though you are hashtagging #OhmHour and #OhmConnect. It took me a few times to get it right.
    After you get a good Buddy (one that participates), each post on your Buddy page earns you 5 tokens. They add up if you're chatty. :smiley:
    From your Dashboard, click on "Connect" That page has different smart devices and the number of tokens you can earn when you connect them the first time. @CKWM Yes, for each of my 9 smart plugs, I get 10 tokens each time OhmConnect automatically turns them off for an OhmHour.
    Sometimes the OhmConnect Surveys will award 100 tokens for completing them. Not always, though.

  • CKWMCKWM Fremont, CAPosts: 235Member
  • CKWMCKWM Fremont, CAPosts: 235Member

    @KadieLPorter, @teja235g, @Ronica Hesbon - here's where your conversation has progressed to.

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